Kurt Carlson
11/20/08

Be natural. Get out in nature (you don't have to
build there). Stop sprawl and protect habitat. Eat
a balanced diet with lots of plants. Go hunting
for food, especially when its good for the
community and biodiversity to control the deer
herd. Wolves only eat 20-25 deer a year each, so
we would need 40 to 50 times the number of wolves
as we have now to replace the Fall hunt. Ha! I
can't wait for Saturday.

fallsky
11/19/08

Hi, Loud and company -

I am a female in my mid-twenties. I have an
excellent education, with a degree from a
prestigious college and I have lived in a third
world country. I am an advocate for human rights
and environmental stewardship. I even consider
myself a "flexaterian." The point I am getting to
is- I hunt. Not only that, I like to hunt.

I can closely relate to the following comment:

"I often find myself shifting from an urge to
keep my hunting a secret to an urge to boast about
it – depending on my company."

Although I may be intimidated to share that I am
a hunter, I almost always do. I think it is
important for people to see that an educated
activist (who also happens to be a female!) can
also be a country girl who goes hunting. I don't
think that these qualities/hobbies need to be a
contradiction.

Hunting, when done properly, is a beautiful
sport. All too often hunting is stereotyped in
ways that really get my goat.

Happy hunting, don't stereotype, +be safe!

Ronin
11/18/08

What else do you think we do with the deer? That
is the main reason people hunt, is it not? I mean,
if you're not there for the meat, what's the
point?
Seriously though, I am taking the views of the
hunters I know(family/friends/co-workers/people
I’ve met hunting) and I guess figuring they are
a good cross section of people(many different
walks of life, backgrounds, philosophy,
traditions, employment, ect) and projecting it to
be what I would consider a pretty accurate
comparison of the rest of the state. Also taking
into consideration the things I’ve personally
observed, like the statement that I’ve never
seen an “assault rifle” used hunting.
Scientific? No...... Probably still pretty
accurate? I’d trust it.
Have you ever read the stories around this time
of year about meat processors that give you the
option of donating some of your meat to the local
food pantry? If it wasn’t a successful program,
they wouldn’t still be doing it would they? I
can remember at least 5 years back that this was
happening. I know some parties that pool their
tags, and designate one deer for donation, and
split the rest. I know some hunters that even go
just to donate their meat, because they know they
don’t “need” it. There are many like minded
people in this state, and the “true hunters”
outnumber the guys out “huntin” as far as I
can tell. You know the type, hung over in the
treestand, with a bottle of blackberry brandy in
their pocket, just looking to shoot something even
if it ends up being a rabbit. I usually attribute
the “huntin” type to be the guys from the
Milwaukee/Chicago area invading our north woods to
get out and “do something manly” to prove to
themselves that big city living hasn’t made them
soft.

loud
11/18/08

Ronin -

You're right, I'm wrong about saying what's
spiritual and what's not for someone other than
myself. I'm sorry for that. However, I would
like to know where you are getting your vast
majority numbers about hunters hunting for food,
because I totally disagree with that.

Leah
11/18/08

Wow. You're all getting intense.
For me- I understand hunting and respect that the
majority of hunters use the animal to feed
themselves and their families. This is all fine
and dandy.
But, I just can't get around killing an animal.
Whether it's as intimate as the relationship
between the hunter and it's prey or as detached as
our corporate beef production practices. They are
all so sweet and cute and I am a total bleeding
heart for animals.
So, I don't kill or eat them, and that's all fine
and dandy too. Vegetarians can understand
hunters. Can hunters understand vegetarians?

Ronin
11/18/08

Just because you can "legally" hunt with them
doesn't mean people do. I have never seen anyone
out in the woods with an M-16/AR-15/M-4, and
hunting deer with it. The closest thing anyone
could possibly call an "assault rifle" (though it
isn't)I have seen in the woods is the SKS, which
is actually a very good hunting rifle.
As for the Crossbow issue, if he falls under the
legal rules to be allowed the use of one, then
it's good to go.
Why do you feel you have the final say over what
is more "spiritual" about hunting? Every
experience is different from person to person,
family to family, and hunting party to hunting
party. Personally, I believe that getting a deer
is secondary to spending time with your
friends/family, in the outdoors, taking in the
beauty of nature. I have seen things out
there(weather on a stand or stalking) that you
just don't see everyday. The vast majority of
hunters are good honest folks, wanting to get some
meat for the freezer, and enjoying the wonder of
the outdoors. Not these yahoos that see it as a
time to booze it up out in the woods with high
powered rifles in hand. Yes, they are out there,
but they are in the vast minority, and for the
most part shunned by the real outdoorsmen/women.

MikePaulus
11/17/08

I just didn't want people to think that some of
the things you listed were widely used. Yeah,
people use that stuff, but it's not the norm. And
I'm not sure what makes one object more
"spiritual" than another. I guess that's up to
you.

loud
11/17/08

Mr. Paulus –

You can legally hunt with an AR-15 or M-16 as
long as it’s not fully automatic. Those are
both assault rifles. As for hunting with a
crossbow, I’m well aware that 65 or older and
disabled people generally use them. My father
hunts with a crossbow as a disabled person and he
truly isn’t disabled. So, it very easy to get
around those small law. About the tree stands
you’re probably right. They’ve been around
for a long time, but you can’t call it hunting
from a tree stand and not spiritual at all.
It’s more like watching TV with a gun…

MikePaulus
11/17/08

loud - "assault" weapons are illegal around here,
crossbows are used primarily by disabled hunters,
and hunting from trees has been in practice for
hundreds of years.

loud
11/17/08

Hi Ronin -

Nope, I'm not a vegetarian. I actually come from
a very long line of hunters on both my mothers and
fathers side of the family. Also, I'm in my mid
30s so it's not rebellion either. Anyway, this
spiritual thing that you people keep taking about
might have been there 50-100 years ago, maybe even
20-25 years ago. But, hunting with crossbows,
assault rifles and tree stands there is nothing
spiritual about that and most of those people
couldn't even live 5-7 in the wild on their own.

I understand that there is a deer/car thing, but
that wouldn't have been a problem if we didn't
kill the grey wolf/timber wolf, it would have kept
everything in check. People as we speak are
trying to make it legal to kill them again. These
are the same people that put the bucks up on their
wall...

We put our hands on too many thing and think
we're helping when we're the problem...

Ronin
11/16/08

Loud, you make things so "black and white" when
you don't really understand the reasons people
hunt(why do I get this feeling you're a
vegitarian?).
For most(notice I say most) hunters, it's about
the friendships with other hunters/family, the
wonder of nature and being in the great outdoors,
and getting meat for the freezer. The mounts are
just a trophy of the impressive buck you got, and
a reminder of the animal that gave it's life so
you could eat.
Now, there are some hunters out there that don't
give a shit about any of those things, they just
want to shoot something, and would let the meat
rot, just to get the mount. That, I'll agree is
not a what a true hunter is about.
You might also want to think about the large
ammount of hunters who donate some of their meat
to food pantries, or people they know who need it.
Not all hunters are a bunch of drunken idiots,
hanging out in the woods with loaded firearms.
There are a vast majority that sportsmen who are
taking part in the thinning of the herd and
gathering meat for their family and friends.
Just think of how many vehicle-vs-deer crashes
there would be if the population was not kept in
check!

MikePaulus
11/13/08

Again, if you really want to get into this, a more
avid hunter needs to respond, but I don’t think
loud’s analogy stands up. When hunters say they
“respect” the animal they hunt, they are not
saying they appreciate it in the same way you
appreciate a work of art. So it’s not at all
like loving a beautiful painting and then setting
it on fire (aka “shooting a beautiful buck”).
This particular issue of respect is far, far, far
more complex than appreciating aesthetic beauty
– it’s an entirely different kind of thing.

Obviously, I don’t want to tell you how to
feel. If you’re disgusted, that’s how it is.
But if you’re honestly interested in
understanding modern hunting, you can’t look at
it in simple terms. There are way too many
hunters out there who view killing just as
bluntly, and they are the ones showing the least
respect towards animals.

As far as wall-mounting, I don’t get that
either.

loud
11/13/08

I don't get it. You say "Oh, look at that
beautiful buck over there. I've never seen
anything like it." BANG! "Let's put it up on the
wall now." That disgusts me...

Emily
11/13/08

I always thought hunting was cruel until I met my
fiance, whose family is chock full of avid hunters
- hunters who truly respect the animals, will
never shoot until they're absolutely certain what
they are shooting, and try their hardest to ensure
that their shot will be a "kill shot." They're
careful to follow the animal to shoot it again if
by chance the first shot only wounded it, and they
eat/use every part of each animal. Needless to
say, I'm impressed!

Killing Season
11/12/08

I don't hunt, I don't have a problem with hunters,
but I don't understand it or them for the most
part.